Battlecruisers, BC's

reading, folks. It does help.

any of you picturing quick jumps to get those darn snipers 100km off the gate?

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This better be a joke.

Then they better start spooling their MJD as soon as we start spooling ours, because it's not going to take more than 8 seconds to get into scram range and tackle one with a talos overheating the mwd and scram.

MJD BC fleets?

I hate admitting that Grath is right, but Grath is right.

send out tackle, if they warp off then thats no different than now, however if you do get a successful tackle you can now be there for the kill quickly.

A lot of people are crying over CBCs, for some reason.
I wrote the second paragraph because ABCs could break from this.

Which is one of the reasons I suggested the jump range should be reduced by 25-50%. Have a DIC burn 50km from the fleet in the direction they're aligned and bubble up where they'll land. A good kiter can also burn in the direction they're facing when they active the MJD and keep tackle when they land (pro-tip: can't warp while the MJD is cycling). You could also throw one day old Slashers at them.

And a long point cruiser or frig can, against a BC, click the "keep at range >24km" button to "press here to exit a fight".

Which is why I said 25-50% reduction in jump range and spool-up would be better and more fun for everyone.

There is, it's called scram. Nano/kiting is no different from folks who years ago used WCS in their pvp ships. Your kiting ship works just fine but it might not against the few BC you run in to, surely this is the end of the world.

If you're flying in fleets, there's no reason not to have newbros in Slashers with scram or at least a few DICs that can burn in front of their fleet and bubble. God forbid kiters have to commit something, too.

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Have several DICs spread around the fleet? Primary something without MJD like logi? Position a Lachesis so you keep point after the jump?

This so much...

Its not that hard to combat an MJD. You dont even need an inty, a cruiser with a long point and a MWD can reach a MJD BC that has just used it with enough situational awareness and dedication. Everybody is freaking out and I dont think most have stopped and considered how easily BC's will still be able to be caught and destroyed. Its just another tool in the toolbelt of the brawler to use in case things go **** up and like any good tool it is situational. Stop crying cause now the slow BC has an option to GTFO just like a kitey ship does.

Fozzie I think you're doing great, dont listen to all the nay-sayers

because campers never abuse tornados, right?

Camper's wont get much use out of a MMJD, but they will be adversely affected by it, although by a smaller degree than they are probably imagining right now.

Than bump him....I mean wtf, its like people are trying to say anything to make this mod look like the end of the world. Bump him hard and burn towards his potential landing spot with a OH MWD and OH your long point. If your not alone then its that much easier.

As someone who uses BCs and CSs often, I like this module.

One of the reasons why this module is not overpowered is the three minute cool down timer which I don't recall anyone mentioning, except that they wished the cool down time frame was shorter. My plans to counter the MJD on ABCs is to abuse these 180s by feinting and then focus on catching the ships while the pilots are waiting for the timer to run out so that they can MJD again. During that three minute window, bubbles and warp disruptors will work just fine on them.

Here is something many of you are forgetting. MJD blooms your sig radius, but does not increase your speed for the spool up timer. And because it is considered a prop mod, it cant be used at the same time as an AB or MWD. So for 9-12 seconds, dependent on skills, you are bloomed to 1.5 times your size and stuck at your ships base speed, less so if you change direction before hitting your MJD.

I personally dont see this as OP. Just giving a boost to many ships people previously considered too slow to use because they could not escape if caught in bubbles.

Ok, I'm now caught up with this thread. Thanks for the feedback so far.

I'll be taking the good points brought up in this thread and discussing them with the CSM and the other designers here at the office.

One thing I wanted to make clear is that Micro Jump Drives were never intended to be a battleship only module. When CCP Soniclover introduced them he intended to see how they went and then add more in the future.

I'm seeing two major arguments revolving around the use of MJDs as a disengagement tool.
The fleet level argument I am honestly not swayed by at this time. Providing inexpensive fleet options that don't automatically get wiped when they find themselves in a bad situation is something we consider very valuable. It creates good options for newer FCs to learn with and in particular MMJDs are a very valuable counterbalance to bombs for battlecruisers at the fleet level.
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Fleet of X people with MMJD BC's jumps over, and realizes its a gate camp. Their FC screams "Everyone run MMJD!" and they do exactly that.

scouts don't have MJD's :) and that is the point :)

so kind of like when kiting ships fill up on speed mods so they can engage without ever actually committing

I still contend that asking a brawler to fit a warp core stab to survive being kited is 10x more reasonable than asking a kiter to fit a scram to get a kill. A brawler can still brawl with a single stab, a kiter cannot kite in scram range.

and bad enemies

yeah but then that person would actually be at risk of dying, which isn't fair apparently

I think my 'kiting' ships have all died in brawler mode recently.
to your question, because typically they're taking win or draw engagements. I see a similarity between flying a kiting ship with its inherently laughable damage and tank, and flying a lol brawling CBC and gimping yourself to get a MJD on, to get a (less reliable) gtfo ability for use in honourable pvp.

You want to catch a BC? Go grab it. If you didn't fit for grabbing that BC you won't get it. Rock, paper, scissors. HTFU.

Is it actually, you fit a long point with nanofibers and MWD which ensures you won't die to slower targets while also fitting for projected dps at 20+ km. This is a choice you make in the fitting window, that's why you use kiting ships in the first place.

I see you're starting to nit pick, generally not a good sign. My statement stands, fights are won or lost before the fight even happens. That's why you fly and fit as you do. Now whining about how someone else's fitting choice might cramp your style is hilarious.

Anyone out there aside from me dislike how powerful attack battlecruisers are? I am not saying they are OP, but a minor damage nerf would be nice IMO.

And now you're starting to change the subject, which generally is another bad sign of realising you're losing the argument. "who has the most people" has nothing to do with the MMJD, at all. In fact it's the other way round; it allows a BC to get away from a horde of [insert kiting ships but probably crows], surely you'd enjoy other ships than just yours being able to get away from trouble they don't want to handle?

you're again evading the main point, good.

Also, nothing will change in that scenario other than said BC gimping himself even more due to wasting a mid slot and fitting. I fail to see the problem?

All this does is give brawling ships a fighting chance against the hordes of idiots in Nomens and Ishtars like yourself.